Understanding the Psychology of Meat for Effective Vegan Advocacy_
This video is of Dr. Joy's, "Understanding the Psychology of Meat for Effective Vegan Advocacy" presentation given in Sweden. Melanie Joy, Ph.D., Ed.M. is an ...
This speaker RUINED what would otherwise be a phenomenal lecture by
bringing up the MYTH of male dominance, which besides being a thoroughly
DEBUNKED MYTH, has NOT ONE DAMN THING TO DO WITH THIS SUBJECT MATTER!
This is precisely why the vegan movement, the fake environmentalism
movement, and all these other social movements are making ZERO progress!
Because of feminism being injected where it has ZERO RELEVANCE! There are
plenty of other, in fact TOO MANY forums for feminist propaganda, LEAVE
THAT CRAP OUT OF VEGAN AND ENVIRONMENTAL FORUMS!
I hope you clowns get my point! I would have gave the speaker a 10 from a
1-10 scale for this lecture, but now she gets a ZERO!
When people ask "Where do you draw the line". I always say (I didn't make
this up, but I don't know who said it first):
I don't know where the line is when day turns to night, but I recognize
darkness when I see it.
It's funny, at 25 when she said 'you can just say "well I'm just a bad
person" but people don't tend to do that. That's exactly what I did. I've
been a self loathing meat eater for a decade. Only finally found the
strength to quit meat a month ago. It feels good to not hate myself quite
as much as I used to. I still killed a lot of cows needlessly when I
definitely did already know better. I really believed I was a monster, but
I just kept eating.
+LukeOfTroyThat's amazing. Works the same with me. My body doesn't see most animal products as food anymore. I may still have some slight cravings for chicken meat when I'm really hungry and I smell it, but it's nothing I couldn't handle. Plus those cravings get weaker and weaker the longer you stay vegan. There is this incredible Dr. Bisci who's been raw vegan for 50 plus years and he says he has absolutely no cravings for anything outside his diet. He is well over 80 and his health is impressive.
+Moravian WallachiaThanks :) I'm over 2 months in now, more than a month fully vegan and I really don't crave it anymore. I just don't see it as food anymore. Might as well be made o bad smelling plastic :p
+LukeOfTroy It's really incredible how powerful our taste buds are. They can literally surpress and shut down even the most basic moral principles in us. Sadly, most people don't know that our taste buds/taste preferences are actually capable of changing. I used to LOVE cheese. Now as a vegan I have zero cravings for that and in stead crave plants I didn't crave before. Ever since I am vegan, I became almost addicted to high-pulp orange juice, carrot juice, vegan pizza, broccoli..... Don't be hard on yourself. Now that you are vegan, it's important to create/discover recipes for yourself that you really enjoy, so you are not malnourished and therefore tempted to go back to animal products. Check out f.e. the amazing youtube channel The Vegan Corner. It's full of amazing, delicious recipes. Also if you miss meat, know that there are currently being developed new types of plant meats that are almost undistinguishable from the animal flesh. Also, I hear there are already enough plant-based meats that are pretty tasty. All the recipes are out there on the internet. So enjoy your new vegan identity and thank you for connecting the dots in your head.
+LukeOfTroy Don't go too hard on yourself about it. I did this too; not with veganism so much but with how messed up the world generally is on so many fronts: because I saw it all as so impossible to confront I convinced myself that it was the way things had to be, and so determined myself to adapt into being an evil person. I too saw myself this way for around a decade.
I've been vegan for about 8 years. Earthlings worked to turn me on to
veganism, but I can see that I was just receptive to it, and could not
longer make any excuses. Now, 8 years later I still struggle for ways to
articulate both my passion, and the importance of veganism to others. But I
can see that I was going about it all wrong. The approach you suggest makes
complete sense in hindsight, and I am glad to have watched this video.
Thank you, Dr. Joy and Unnatural Vegan for highlighting a gaping hole in my
approach!
What i am taking away from this video: "Belief of myths allows the comfort
of opinion without the discomfort of thought" JFK So aptly put and so many
levels to this quote! Thanks for sharing, bless.
+Amarylis Jéldrez Aguilera There is a version that is particularly suited for non-vegans as she doesn't speak there about how to communicate with non-vegans, but only talks about carnism and how it works. Just stay here on youtube and put into the search engine: Melanie Joy - Carnism: The Psychology of Eating Meat. It's on Dr. McDoughall's youtube channel. It's the first lecture I saw from her and it encouraged me to watch other as I had so many aha-moments watching that.
I still have about 20 minutes more to go so maybe you address this, but how
do vegans find peace? I don't approach others about veganism. They either
have to find me or ask but even as polite as I can be, there are still
people who get defensive and put me down. They might throw out a joke and
I'm always supposed to take it. And I it's also heart breaking each time
someone understands my viewpoint but then does nothing about it. They
respect my choice and applaud me for my will power, but will still go on
about this new cheese recipe that was soooo good as if it's not disgusting
to me. I scream inside while putting on a smiling face so they don't think
I'm the crazy vegan people villainize us as.
+John Kane I totally agree with the last part you said... family is so hard to convince. I think its because parents feel like its their job to impose their beliefs or the family's beliefs onto their children. And when its the other way around, they put up a very thick defensive wall to convince themselves they're reasoning and logic is more correct than the child's, for example.
+John Kane I definitely have many more vegan friends now through social media and meetup. But I haven't done activism like you've mentioned. Sounds like a great idea! Thanks!
+Firebreathing Vegan It helped me a lot to seek out other vegans. In my case some things that helped on that front were joining my university's animal rights club, joining my region's vegan Facebook/meetup groups and spending a month on Warped Tour with an animal rights group doing outreach. Having a lot of vegan friends and acquaintances definitely helps keep you sane. Also, get out there and do some activism! Especially tabling (i.e. sitting at a table at an event with a bunch of literature on hand and talking to people about veganism) and other direct, education-based forms of it. It's weird, but most people find they have way better luck reaching complete strangers than reaching family, friends, and coworkers. I always feel a lot better about the world after I've spent a day talking to people and know I've made an impact on at least a few of them.
+veganArmenian My friends and family are very polite about my habits, but they always forget I'm vegan when they talk about their animal recipes, for example. They know how delicious my food is and how healthy I am.
if you can remember when you were a meat eater and you completely distanced yourself from the cruel realities. I feel like I'm a better person as a vegan for understanding most people who eat meat do not look at there food as a living being. It's like eating an apple to them. I have a vegan party at my house every 3 months and invite all of my meat eating friends. They leave happy because the food is great. Try it see how your friends and family react.
The World Peace Diet
A presentation by Will Tuttle, Ph.D.. Dr. Will Tuttle will present the main ideas in his book, The World Peace Diet. It has been called one of the most important ...
No doubt ownership and agriculture has created great suffering. However,
indigenous peoples living in colder climates ate wild fish and hunted
animals. We too, are animals.
+Daniel Clement Does that justify continuing with old mistakes, Daniel? We do not NEED to torture others and, as a matter of fact, eating animals causes us heart disease, diabetes, auto-immune diseases and FEEDS cancers!!! Slavery was also a mistake we continued for far too long. Time to wake up and create a much kinder, healthier, more loving world for EVERYONE... including ALL animals. <3
+Marcus Bradley PLEASE read Dr. Tuttle's EXTREMELY brilliant book before you judge his ideas. Using others for our selfish purposes is the ROOT CAUSE of virtually every problem we humans cause ourselves. But don't take my word for it. Dr. Tuttle really makes the connections in his very well-researched and well-documented masterpiece. //smile.amazon.com/World-Peace-Diet-Spiritual-Harmony/dp/1590560833/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1423091588&sr=8-1&keywords=world+peace+diet
+FruityHachi Very true... and the irony is that we ARE animals and we don't like to think of ourselves that way. Read Dr. Tuttle's book. It is STUNNING!!! <3
+Marcus Bradleyread the book "eternal treblinka" by charles patterson. it goes into detail how the way we treat non-human animals is intertwines with how we treat each other. that all forms of discrimination (racism, sexism, homophobia etc.) starts with speciesism (viewing non-human animals as mere objects which humans have the right to do whatever they please with them).for example, did you know that the nazis learned how to construct concentration camps for jews based on observing how we confined cows, pigs, chickens. and did you know that in order to view other people as something less, the oppressors wanted to de-humanize them and started to regard jews, native americans, blacks, chinese, japanese as "animals". and even nowadays, the ultimate insult is to call the other person that "they´re/act like animals".
+Marcus Bradley Part of the problem is how heavily resource reliant animal agriculture is. Inputs include land, water and oil to power the machinery. Think about the wars being fought over oil and the environmental and war derived refugees on this planet.
If one is truly interested here is a good article about the issue...https://answersingenesis.org/death-before-sin/biblically-could-death-have-existed-before-sin/
+Marcus BradleyThen I would suggest you read Scripture. Especially Genesis and the account of the Fall.Before the Fall human beings were Vegan. After all manner of disgusting habits and conditions entered. Including the eating of other "now" sentient beings.Few things could be anymore relevant to the discussion.
+Mr Stephen BrownMaybe people don't differentiate between a grape and a Big Mac because it's actually isn't as important as Dr. Will tuttle says that it is. I'm not to entirely sure where you stand on this. But to think that we (humans), could ever so possibly restore ourselves to our original state by means of us doing something,like taking a step toward God, which is like taking a step toward infinity, is really just futile. We cannot cure the world if we cannot cure ourselves and changing our diet, foundational changes nothing about us. At heart every human is wicked, and this wickedness is directly in correspondence to the problems we see in society and directly tied to human death. True change, (spiritual) change, again can't come through diet which reflects an original state. Because food and spirituality don't communicate in the way that Dr. Tuttle suggest. We make decisions to eat food. To say that food makes decisions sounds crazy. Please do not elevate veganism as some type of salvation from human problems, it will end in disappointment. The human problem is much deeper and much more complicated than animal slaughter.
+Marcus BradleyI would argue since we are fallen, we must always compare what our state was prior to present day. Before the Fall we were vegans from all appearances. After the Fall , pain, suffering and the killing of most everything entered the equation. This is a degraded state we find ourselves in. I doubt you can argue otherwise to that.If the point of one's life is to return back as close as is possible in this condition to a pre-Fall state, then one is best to return to our planned on diet when created. Of course most human beings have no idea what I am proposing here so they have convinced themselves a Big Mac is the same as a grape.
I dont think you understand the purpose of food. Food is substinece for you body. Food does not have a conscience therfore it can not give us morale. For example, whether a person has a salad vs a cheeseburger for lunch, they will still have important decsions to make. Decions completely irrelevant to food. Food doens't give us thoughts, thoughts give us thoughts. Im not dissing on people who choose to be vegan, in fact I respect people who are discipline enough to it. However a society full of vegans might produce a healthier society, but by no means a utopia. I don't care what diet your on people are still screw up. (By the way I'm pretty sure that scripture does permit for people to eat meat. In the New Testament.)
Killing is a violent act...even if you're doing it for food...there is no need to kill...therefore, it promotes peace through non-violent dietary means...IMO
You reap what you sow. Treat others as you would like to be treated. It starts with the very subsistence which gives you life and must extend outward. If you don't get the basics right how else is anything beyond going to be moral? correct? honest? balanced? fair? sustainable? it isn't.11:00 All beings have interests. When God said humans have dominion I doubt he meant a license to ignore, quite the opposite. I would submit we have a massive DUTY to make sure all the creatures of his land do not have their integrity ruined by anything we do. Eating them when we don't have to is hardly living true to the Scriptures.
It's not a good idea to have a cat be vegan, even with synthesized
supplements, they at least need some real meat for their diet otherwise it
is considered to be unhealthy for them, and they can grow ill or die with
an unnatural diet. Cat food with mostly feet and feathers is considered a
NATURAL diet for cats, this is why it is sometimes suggested to give cats
raw chicken necks. A cat's digestive system is based on it's diet of birds,
small rodents / etc which basically has fur/feathers, bones
@starfaery Taurine is found in a supplement known as Vegecat or Vegekit.
This supplement includes all nutrients a cat or a kitten needs to survive
and be healthy. Most people say that taurine and other nutrients such as
B-12 cannot be found in a vegan diet, but they can be synthesized, and the
taurine in REGULAR cat food, is also synthesized because the "meat" in cat
food is basically feet & feathers (not nutritionally dense.) So the cat
isn't really getting much meat in a regular diet either.
@OneThousandOwls Show me evidence of a cat in nature that chooses to be a
vegan and I'll believe what you say. Otherwise, cats need natural protein
found in MEAT. Synthesized crap is for you plant munchers, not for animals.
If you put a cat into it's natural habitat is it going to take herbs and
synthesize B-12 or eat a bird? Some meat is much better than complex
scientific hippie tree-hugger vegan crap. If you want to be a vegan, fine.
Just let your cat be a cat, they like MEAT.
oh you stupi idiot people, that kitten is going to become deaf,blind,have
rickets, get liver and kidney failure and basically live an unhappy and
short life. a cat need amino acids only found in meat, they need turine and
B-12. you are killing that kitten by only feeding it ra fruit and
vegatables, not even a human can live very well on that kind of diet,
protein and B-12 are needed by humans to.
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