Trinity college cite source Videos

+Truth Of Islam Did you become a Muslim? If not, then you have an awfully funny username.

+Pentecostal Church of Jesus 2k1 well said bro! IF THE WORD DOES NOT WORK FOR YOU THEN TEST THE HOLY SPIRIT.ok lets check it out.MATT 27:5 judas die by hanging after having thrown the money he receive.ACT 1:18 with the money judas bought a field and.....all his intestine was spread .ASK THE HOLY SPIRIT TO CLARIFY.According to 16:17 If you drink deadly poison youll not be hurt, CAN YOU DO THIS???

The reason why I know the 4 gospels is real is because of spirtual proof. The bible says the father, the word and the holy spirit work as one. We all know the father is god, next is to read the word, if the word doesn't work for you then test the holy spirit. Jesus said john 14,14 " if you ask anything in my names I will do it"Jesus said Mark 16:17 " In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;18 " they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."So unless you test the spirit then you shouldn't evan question the wether the 4 gospels are real or not

+HTC One Jesus is the gospel. The gospel is the birth,the life, the death, the ressurection and the 2nd coming of Jesus christ.  Thats the full gospel and the 4 gospels states these things so I dont know what your talking about

+Ajid Ijan- What images are you talking about. So when you people are praying in Islam, you are asked to visualize images in your brain?- What embarrassment are you talking about?

I am asking you to prove that I'm a fool for seeing 3 images. But for your question, yes..Allah can do anything except to get Himself embarrassed.

+Ajid Ijan When your Quran tells you that "Allah can do all things",  who do you understand and don't?

+A. Wilson B.Why I am a fool? Prove it.  ... but it is easy to prove the three images.

+tornado 1 You are a fool...

I think three images...that's for sure..

Your haddith sources say other wise.. James White and Yufef Ishmael debated this and Ishmael was pretty much creamed about this. Everything he said was straw man and fallacious.. And even IF the quran was perfectly transmitted - means, for muhammad had writings existent much before the quran - a pile of borrowings.. I will show you 3 examples about Jesus Christ.

So the quran is chinese whispers? lol makes sense 

Honestly can you produce 1 contradictive verse from the Qur'an and not hadith's. Can you? Where are there variations? Where. Stop talking and start proving. Prove it. No fairytales please or story telling but actually show something.

+willie beam Amen

OK mate lol Willie hahahahahah in Britain that means penis

+blackdarknite1 Jesus is the Word of God.the Bible is the word of man inspired by God. The bible shows us the consequence of sins and what man has when he live apart from GodWe don't have the Bible as the same way a Muslim has the Quran, They believe that the Quran is the eternal word of godWe don't believe that the Bible is the eternal word of God butJesus is call the Word of God.John 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

+Dave Biddle I'm an agnostic, so i don't have a dog in this fight. I'll play devils advocate, Just like you would affirm that King James Bible is the word of God, yet it has passages like the Pericope Adulterae that you don't believe in. Couldn't Muhammad say the same about the Torah without believing everything in it?

+Diego Oliveira Great hadith!  I always love to see the lengths that people go to explain it away. 

+IzaFaqat //sunnah.com/abudawud/40/99

+IzaFaqat I am honored that a Muslim wants to rationally discuss the Bible and Quran.  Thank you!YOU "Dave, we do have historical records to show (a) repression and destruction of biblical texts which did not cater to the creed of the Romans, and (b) records to show the Jews and Christians of the Arabian peninsula, and others from places like Damascus believed a new prophet was coming"RESPONSE Please show me how you deduce this.YOU "In other words if we have a historical record from a trustworthy source to say there was a bible that said "xyz", would it be logical to completely discredit this record? "If the source is trustworthy, then it would not be logical to completely discredit this record.  I agree.We would first have to be very consistent in how we determine whether or not a source is trustworthy. I think that this requires quite a bit of discipline and objectivity.While I wait for your evidence, I want to ask you a few questions about what your Quran says.  You seem to be a studious educated person who can read well and understand implications.Would you mind reading surah 10:94, surah 5:68, surah 5:44-48 and surah 4:136 for me?1. When do you claim the Bible was corrupted?  Before Muhammad?  During Muhammad's life?  After Muhammad?2. Do you think that Allah abrogates historical events?3. What do you believe is Biblical corruption?  Manuscript variants?  Or changes to doctrine, faith, and practice?  Or because you consider the Quran to be 100% perfect, without a single vowel pointer or diacritical mark out of place, down to the smallest jot and if the Bible had 1 manuscript variant, that the Bible would be corrupted?4. In surah 3:3 and 6:114-115 (Muhsin -Khan's translation is very helpful here), the Quran says that Allah gave the Tawrat and Injil and that no one can change his words.  What are your thoughts here in how they relate to the Muslim accusation of Biblical corruption?5. Surah 7:157 is a present-tense command saying that Jews and Christians will find Muhammad prophesied of in their scriptures.  Do you believe that Muhammad is prophesied of in the Bible?  If so, where and why?

+Dave Biddle Dave, we do have historical records to show (a) repression and destruction of biblical texts which did not cater to the creed of the Romans, and (b) records to show the Jews and Christians of the Arabian peninsula, and others from places like Damascus believed a new prophet was comingDo we have these texts today? No, but how can we rationalize those above facts? In other words if we have a historical record from a trustworthy source to say there was a bible that said "xyz", would it be logical to completely discredit this record? 

+IzaFaqat "For example it's a historical fact that the Jews of Medina, believed a new prophet was coming from their scriptures. That's extremely evident. So the question is, why? "Show me their scriptures and then we can examine what prophet they were expecting."As for the Bible being the same in the time of Muhammad, just because the Codex Vaticanus is roughly the same (it actually includes more books), doesn't mean the other bibles around the world were the same."If you want to say this, then I can say that there are REAL Qurans which actually do confirm the Bible and that you read a false corrupt Quran.  If you don't need to provide any evidence to support wild claims, then I don't need any either!  Is this the way we should be having this discussion?  But actually, since the Bible was canonized three centuries before Muhammad, yes, you need to prove that there was some other writings that mainstream Christians accepted as scripture.  You can't just say, "Well, maybe there were others."  That's not good enough.  Until you can actually produce some evidence of what you're saying, you have absolutely no proof of your claim. SPEAKING OF BURDEN OF PROOF, it lies on YOU to show that the actual Christian scripture is something other than the Bible which was canonized which you have accepted as being canonized 300 years before Muhammad.Yes, there are some extra books in Codex Vaticanus - these are Old Testament apocryphal books not included in the Jewish canon and justifiably not in the actual canon.  There is still zero change in Biblical doctrine or zero change regarding the birth, life, ministry, crucifixion death, and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ as the ONLY manner of salvation that a person can obtain.By arguing for the possibility of ANOTHER scripture that could speak of Muhammad, you are conceding that the modern Bible which contains the same doctrines as the Christian scriptures ALWAYS has, does NOT prophesy of Muhammad.surah 7:157 makes a bold claim which the Biblical manuscript history does not even remotely affirm.  You have an enormous burden of proof to demonstrate why the Bible does not prophesy of Muhammad when your "Allah" said it does.

+Dave Biddle Yes, because you made the claim the burden of proof is on you. That's just a logical truth.As for the Bible being the same in the time of Muhammad, just because the Codex Vaticanus is roughly the same (it actually includes more books), doesn't mean the other bibles around the world were the same.For example it's a historical fact that the Jews of Medina, believed a new prophet was coming from their scriptures. That's extremely evident. So the question is, why? 

+IzaFaqat Burden of proof is on me?  LOL!  Okay!  Whatever you say!  This is just like many Muslims I talk with - they refuse to acknowledge what their own sources say.  Every Muslim I've talked to, at least to me, has rejected clear simple passages in their own Quran.  That's why they play games like you're playing - trying to make it seem that no one can know what Islam says without reading it in Arabic.  If the Quran and sunnah only means anything in Arabic, then keep it in Arabia to those who read and speak the Quraish dialect.Just so you know, you have to play games because you can't just resort to the truth. Did you know that our modern Bible is the same as it was in Muhammad's day?  Do you know we have New Testaments that are 300 years before Muhammad that teach the same Christian doctrine that it does today?

Burden of proof is on you though. If you simply concede you cannot find it, sure I'll find it.

+IzaFaqat Oh, look at how reasonable you are now - only after playing games and getting put in a corner where you are forced to deny your false unstudied statements.You taught yourself Arabic?  So then check the translation for yourself and stop playing games with me.  I posted the hadith.  It couldn't be clearer.  And look at how Rashid plays games.  Like you!  

+Dave Biddle Well, I mean, I taught myself Arabic, so I could better understand the Qur'an. The message is universal, but if you want to argue semantic points and get specific (as you're trying to do) a mastery in the Arabic language is key. 

+IzaFaqat Okay.  So why should any non-Arabic speaker believe Muhammad?Obviously, by your rationale, the Quran only addresses people who fluently read and speak classical Arabic in the Quraish dialect.  Therefore, the Quran doesn't apply to anyone who doesn't speak that language.  According to you, Islam is just a local cult for those fluent in classical Quraish.  Thank you for instructing me that the Quran does not pertain to me or anyone in the non-Arabic-Quraish-dialec-speaking world.

+Dave Biddle Huh? How can I accept the Quran, or Muhammad saying something merely with an English rendition, when they didn't say it in English?

+IzaFaqat Don't talk to me in English. I probably won't accept it from you any more.  From now on, you talk to me in...hmmm....Gaelic.  Yes, I will only accept Gaelic from you from now on.

+IzaFaqat So then no Muslim who can't read and write Arabic fluently is actually a Muslim because they have no idea what they believe and they have to believe in what ignorant Imams and lying Muslim apologists tell me?  Yes, I agree.  Islam is based on keeping its adherents in the dark and ignorant.  80% of the world's Muslims can't read or write Arabic, much less classical Arabic in the Quraysh dialect.Are you telling me that they are not Muslims?  Yes or no?  If they are Muslims, then reading and/or writing Arabic is not necessary.  If they are NOT Muslims, then Islam is a deceitful religion who demands that people submit to it under pain of death without being able to understand what they're submitting to. But since you're going to be such a reasonable man with me, I will be equally as reasonable with you.I only accept the original Quran text written in the primitive Arabic which had no vowel pointers and diacritical marks.  And I will only accept the original Quran text that's written on the pieces of animal bone, leaves, parchments, the backs of dead squirrels and whatever other nonsensical things the Quran was written on that Zaid collected.  Your Quran today is written in a different form of written language than it originally was.  Therefore, your Quran is corrupted.  Since you can't provide Quran references in the original early primitive script, I discount everything the Quran says as garbage (I already discount the Quran as the work of a man, a man who was ignorant of the Jewish and Christian scriptures, a man who was ingrained with pagan practices and who incorporated these polytheistic worship practices into his manufactured religion of islam).

Again not sure what you're talking about. I just asked for a simple Arabic quote, since that's what we accept as proof, not renditions in English. 

+IzaFaqat Can you show me a passage in the Quran that says the Jewish and Christian scriptures are corrupted?  Since you're being so reasonable with me, I will only accept the passage in the ORIGINAL Arabic which lacks vowel pointers and diacritical marks.  Then I will need you to cite the Quran you found this in.  If you can't do this, I will have to assume that you are reading from some corrupted Quran.

+IzaFaqat Yes, I know you asked.  

+Dave Biddle not quite sure what you're talking about. i just asked for the source in arabic, 

+IzaFaqat Sir, you can lie to yourself all you want.  I cited the source.  The problem is your own self-deception and refusal to acknowledge the truth.  This is a pathetic approach, sir..

+Dave Biddle I'm asking for the Arabic source because that's the language the actual words were spoken in. I of course could find it but you're the one using it as proof.

+IzaFaqat Burden of proof?  Sir, I GAVE the proof.  If you want to bury your head in the sand, that's your business!  I gave the citation from the MUSLIM SOURCE and I included the reference.  Your response is pathetic.  Are you saying that this Muslim source does not exist in Arabic?  Is that what you're saying?Of course you're not saying that.  You're playing games.  Your own Muslim apologist didn't reject James White citing it in English.  Your Muslim apologist responded to it in English.  Only your apologist's response doesn't make any sense at all whether the quote was in Arabic or English!Go play games with your Muslim friends.  Not me.

burden of proof is on you, innit

+IzaFaqat If you are an Arabic speaker, use the reference I gave to look it up in Arabic.  

can you post the actual arabic for this?

+underground0331you can keep your sermon for your church sheep...

Logia 1978You speak of rational thinking yet you fail to even understand what the Book of Revelation is even about. I already know that your mind and eyes are shut, so I will spare you the explanation. I can only hope that you will desire the light, the True Light instead of the darkness that you are clearly in. I weep for your kind, because you think you know God and do Him service, but you don't.

+underground0331God of christianity love those sinners so much that on his second coming, Jesus will kill them with his sword coming out of his mouth according to the book of revelation....I dont need your payer or your sermon.. I need real rational facts....

Logia1978 It can clearly be seen that the god of islam only loves those who do something for him. While the the God of Christianity loves sinners and unbelievers alike which is why He sent His only Son to die for them. John 15:13 Greater love has no man than this: that a man lay down his life for his friends. I really hope you perform good enough for your god for your own peace of mind. Me, I am saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ which is a free gift from God the Father (Ephesians 2:8,9). I will pray for you that one day you will know the true love of God which is not dependent on your works and traditions, but on God and how much He loves His creation and desires that none will perish. Jesus Christ is King of your life whether you like it or not, and He commands you to repent and turn from your unbelief to belief in His Gospel (death, burial and resurrection from the dead). Everyday that you don't you are living a life of disobedience to your creator and you are storing up for yourself the Holy wrath of Almighty God. Turn from your false religion before it is too late for you.

Logia1978 Yes the God of Christianity is merciful, but He is also just. His justice and mercy are demonstrated on the cross of Jesus Christ. Is the god of islam merciful toward all people? According to you qur'an he is not. Qur’an 3:31-32—Say [O Muhammad]: If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. Say: Obey Allah and the Apostle; but if they turn back, then surely Allah does not love the unbelievers.Your god's love is conditional. But the God of Christianity's love is unconditional. John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life. Romans 5:8-10 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. How much more then, being now justified by His blood, shall we be saved from wrath through Him. For if while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of His Son, how much more, being reconciled, shall we be saved by His life.

+underground0331rhetoric only...You did not answer my questions because you know that you are wrong.Is the god of Christianity merciful ? Christian's says yes...But he can not forgive unless blood is shed because he is according to Christians too holy...Where is the mercy then ?Mercy is you forgive someone for your own sake....You are not going to punish before forgiving...This is the true concept of god.And even your bible says it:Isaiah 43:25"I, even I, am he who blots out your transgressions, for my own sake, and remembers your sins no more."Is He lying ?of course not... and it's the same answer as Islam gives.You Christians forget that nothing we do can ever reach or have any power on the holiness of god... God Is Beyond what we humans do....If you think you have any power on god, any pressure on Him, because of your sin or right actions, then you are misguided.

Logia1978And that's the difference between the god of islam and God of Christianity. The god of islam is not a just god but one who lets anything go. The God of Christianity has attributes that never cease. The God of Christianity is all loving, perfectly holy, perfectly just simultaneously and His attributes are never diminished. But the god of Islam is ever changing and inconsistent. One day you will know the truth when you bow your knee to King Jesus and confess that He is Lord, but by then it may be too late for you.

+underground0331You are irrational....I asked you some questions and you are avoiding them...Who created Human's imperfect and able to sin ?Why would he then want us to be perfect ?He does not want us to be perfect but to do our best. That's all.All the rest you wrote is a sermon I don't need.. I need rational answers and not blind faith.That's why christianity will always lose against Islam.

Logia1978 If you have been taught to do your best, I am sorry but you have been lied to. God expects perfection. The problem is nobody who is human can be perfect in and of their own works. This is why Jesus came, so by faith in Christ's Gospel (death, burial and resurrection) we are counted as righteous. Romans 10:9 KJVThat if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.I'm telling you, don't miss out on this opportunity of salvation. Someone will have to pay for your sin one day, that can either be you (which is death) or Jesus who died on a cross and defeated death by resurrection. I plead with you my friend, the Bible has not been corrupted, it contains the truth of God, it always has and always will.

Logia1978You say that God doesn't want us perfect, but Jesus says this,Matthew 5:48 KJVBe ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.This verse is when Jesus was preaching the sermon on the mount. God is in no need of us, you are right. But think for a minute. Do you honestly think that you as a sinner will be able to stand before a Perfect and Holy God and He won't punish your sin? "The wages of sin is death" (Roman 3:23). Anyone who sins is destined to die, physically and spiritually. But this is where the good news of the Gospel comes in. God loves you and me so much that He sent His only Son to live a perfectly sinless life, and to die on a cross, taking upon Himself the full weight of God's wrath. See God has to punish sin, and this is why Jesus came, to take our penalty upon Himself and in turn, credited us with His righteousness. So on the day of Judgement, we will be covered with the righteousness of Jesus which is perfect and not our own righteousness which is as filthy rags in God's sight (Isaiah 64:6).

Logia1978See that is where you are in error. Your prophet said,Sahih International (Surah 10:94)So if you are in doubt, [O Muhammad], about that which We have revealed to you, then ask those who have been reading the Scripture before you. The truth has certainly come to you from your Lord, so never be among the doubters.Do you know what the word scripture means? It means something written down. You say that they had revelation, but your prophet says that their were books. And it is an irrefutable fact that we have manuscripts dated to the time of Muhammad and before Muhammad. So if Muhammad affirmed that the SCRIPTURE, and we know what it says, and our Bible reads exactly the same as back then, then it is you that is in error and not the Christians. I invite to stop listening to your teachers and with an open mind, read the Gospel of Jesus Christ and learn the real truth.

+underground0331My prophet never said the book you have are from god.. My prophet said revelation have been given to Moses and Jesus....those revelation are from god... You don't have those revelation any more.God himself created us imperfect and able to sin... why does he want us to be perfect then...? Adam was not perfect. Adam was tempted (imperfection) and sinned (imperfection) He was like us, he did not know the future (imperfection) nore the past (imperfection), He needs other things to eat and to live (imperfection).God wants us to do our best. That's all.Nothing we can do will ever touch or will ever diminish the perfection of God...He is not bounded by our imperfection. He is needless. This is the true conception of god, creator of universe.If you think, that you little human (wich is a worm in the bible) have any power or impact on god because of your sins, Then you have a very  poor conception of what GOD the creator of Universe is...

Logia1978:According to your own prophet the Torah and Gospel are God's Word (Surah 10:94). We have thousands of manuscripts that are dated from the 7th century and before. So we know exactly what the Torah and Gospel said at the time of Muhammad. Most Muslims are taught that the Bible has been changed, but your own Qur'an says that no one can change Allah's words (Surah 18:27). My brother in humanity, Jesus Christ commands you to repent and turn to Him. He is the one true God Who entered into His creation to save us from our fallen and sinful nature that we have inherited from Adam. May I ask, would you admit that you are a sinner? God is perfect, and the standard to be in His presence is perfection. No matter what we do in this life, we will never be perfect; therefore, we are destined to spend eternity away from God because He cannot tolerate sin. This is why Jesus came to us in the flesh, to bear the full weight of His wrath and impute His righteousness upon us so we can stand before a Holy and perfect God completely guiltless. I invite you not to write this Good News off, but to search out the truth. Please don't remain in darkness thinking that you serve the light, Jesus Christ is the Light of the World (John 8:12).

+underground0331First of all, what is god's words?No gospel writers ever claimed writing god's word or be inspired by god...Those are humans, or historians who saw Jesus and wrote what they saw and felt...The real gospel is the one Jesus received from god.. Jesus was not preaching, Mark, Luke, Matthew or John's gospel....Why should god protect these gospels then ?

+underground0331First of all, what is god's words?No gospel writers ever claimed writing god's word or be inspired by god...Those are humans, or historians who saw Jesus and wrote what they saw and felt...The real gospel is the one Jesus received from god.. Jesus was not preaching, Mark, Luke, Matthew or John's gospel....Why should god protect these gospels then ?